My Latest Chat with A.I.

Chat-GPT and I have a lot of fun.

I am amazed by the speed and the 'conversations' we have. No doubt that the tool can be used for good and, like everything, has potential negative implications as well.

I have found the Biblical research it does to be quite extensive. It can search the Bible with uncanny speed and accuracy.

My latest convo ended up being super interesting. I have been thinking through whether the 7 trumpets in Revelation could be 'visible' in a figurative way. There are many issues as we consider the trumpet judgments and primarily is the lack of many 'time' references (on purpose I believe).

When John writes, 'after this' I believe it is in reference to the order of visions and not necessarily a linear timeline.

An issue is the specific mention of "1/3" as the scope of these disturbing images. So I wanted to put some 'numbers' to this section- and I asked my ChatGPT researcher some questions.

Here is how it went:

You

On a given day, how many people die worldwide and how are these deaths broken down?

ChatGPT

On average, around 150,000 people die worldwide every day. These deaths are broken down into various categories, with the most common causes being:

1. Cardiovascular diseases: These include heart attacks, strokes, and other heart-related conditions.

2. Respiratory diseases: Such as pneumonia, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), and asthma.

3. Cancers: Malignant tumors that affect different organs and tissues in the body.

4. Infectious diseases: Including HIV/AIDS, tuberculosis, malaria, and other infectious illnesses.

5. External causes: Such as accidents, injuries, and violence.

6. Other non-communicable diseases: Such as diabetes, Alzheimer's disease, and kidney diseases.

The distribution of these causes of death may vary from one region to another and can change over time due to various factors such as advancements in healthcare, changes in lifestyle, and environmental conditions.

how many people would die if 1/3 of the earth's population passed away?

The current estimated global population is around 7.9 billion people.

If one-third of the Earth's population were to pass away, the calculation would be:

13×7.9 billion=7.9×1093=2.633 billion

I omitted long equations - But CHATGPT always shows its work!

So, approximately 2.633 billion people would die.

You

if 150,000 people die each day, how long would it take for 2.6 billion people to die?

ChatGPT

If you want this in years:

Number of years=17,333.33365

So, it would take approximately 47.5 years for 2.6 billion people to die at a rate of 150,000 people per day.

You

If an earth day is like a 1,000 years to the Lord- what is 50 earth days like

ChatGPT

If we're using the biblical reference from 2 Peter 3:8, which says, "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day," we can calculate the equivalent time in "the Lord's time."

If 1 Earth day = 1000 years in the Lord's time, then:

Lord’s time for 50 Earth days=50×1000=50,000 years

So, 50 Earth days would be equivalent to 50,000 years in the Lord's time.

You

using the 2 Peter verse- what is 50 Lord's days like on earth?

ChatGPT

To find out what 50 days in the Lord's time would be like on Earth, we need to do the reverse calculation.

If 1 day in the Lord's time is like 1000 years on Earth, then:

Earth time for 50 Lord’s days=50×1000 years=50,000 years

So, 50 days in the Lord's time would be equivalent to 50,000 years on Earth.

You

What is the net of birth rate and death rate currently on planet earth?

ChatGPT

As of my last update in January 2022, the global birth rate was estimated to be approximately 18.5 births per 1,000 people per year, and the global death rate was estimated to be around 7.7 deaths per 1,000 people per year.

To find the net growth rate, you subtract the death rate from the birth rate:

So, the net growth rate is approximately 10.8 per 1,000 people per year.

Keep in mind that these figures can vary slightly from year to year and may have changed since my last update.

You

On an average day, there are 150,000 human deaths. How is that number impacted during times of war?

ChatGPT

During times of war, the number of human deaths can increase significantly due to various factors such as direct combat, bombings, displacement, disease, and famine. The impact on the number of deaths can vary greatly depending on the scale and intensity of the conflict.

In times of war:

1. Direct combat: Soldiers and civilians are directly killed in battles, skirmishes, and attacks.

2. Bombings and attacks: Aerial bombings, missile strikes, and ground assaults can lead to mass casualties among civilians and combatants.

3. Displacement: War often leads to large-scale displacement of populations, and many people may die due to lack of access to basic necessities such as food, water, and medical care.

4. Disease and famine: War-torn areas may experience outbreaks of diseases due to disrupted healthcare systems and unsanitary conditions. Famine can also occur due to disruptions in food supply chains.

The number of deaths during times of war can vary significantly depending on the specific conflict, but it can be much higher than the average daily death toll of 150,000. In some of the deadliest conflicts in history, the number of deaths has reached millions.

You

what would be an average daily number of global deaths if there were a worldwide war?

ChatGPT

Estimating the average daily number of global deaths during a worldwide war is challenging and would depend on various factors such as the scale and intensity of the conflict, the duration of the war, the weapons used, and the effectiveness of humanitarian efforts.

However, we can make a rough estimate based on historical data from some of the deadliest conflicts in history.

For example, during World War II, which is considered one of the deadliest conflicts in human history, an estimated 70 to 85 million people died over a span of six years.

If we take the midpoint of this estimate (77.5 million) and divide it by the number of days in six years (approximately 2190 days), we can estimate the average daily number of deaths during World War II:

So, during World War II, the average daily number of deaths was approximately 35,410.

This is a rough estimate and would vary depending on the specific circumstances of the hypothetical worldwide war.

You

would that number not include the 150,000 per day death rate?

At that point I was surprised!

Chat GPT apologized to me! LOL

ChatGPT

You're correct. I apologize for the oversight. To find the average daily number of global deaths during a worldwide war, we need to add the average daily death rate to the estimated number of deaths during the war.

You

How many years would an 180,000 per death day take to reach 2.6 billion people?

ChatGPT

To find out how many years it would take for 2.6 billion people to die at a rate of 180,000 deaths per day, we can use the following calculation:

Number of years≈39.6 years

So, it would take approximately 39.6 years for 2.6 billion people to die at a rate of 180,000 deaths per day.

You

I'm working on a document that takes the trumpet judgements in Revelation and tries to apply a time estimate for 1/3 of the earth to be impacted by the calamities listed there

ChatGPT

That sounds like an intriguing project! The trumpet judgments in the Book of Revelation (Revelation 8:6–9:21) describe catastrophic events that will occur during the end times.

To estimate the time it would take for one-third of the Earth's population to be impacted by these calamities, you may need to make some assumptions based on the descriptions in Revelation. Here's a rough estimation:

1. First Trumpet (Revelation 8:7): Hail and fire, mixed with blood, are thrown to the earth, burning up a third of the trees and all the green grass. This could cause significant damage to vegetation and result in famine and ecological devastation.

2. Second Trumpet (Revelation 8:8-9): Something like a great mountain, burning with fire, is thrown into the sea, causing a third of the sea to become blood, a third of the living creatures in the sea to die, and a third of the ships to be destroyed. This could cause massive loss of life, especially among coastal populations, and disrupt global trade.

3. Third Trumpet (Revelation 8:10-11): A great star, blazing like a torch, falls from the sky on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. The name of the star is Wormwood, and a third of the waters turn bitter, causing many people to die from drinking the water. This could cause widespread contamination of freshwater sources and lead to further loss of life.

4. Fourth Trumpet (Revelation 8:12): A third of the sun, moon, and stars are struck, causing a third of them to be darkened. This could lead to decreased agricultural productivity, ecological disruption, and possibly extreme weather events.

5. Fifth Trumpet (Revelation 9:1-12): A star falls from heaven, and the abyss is opened, releasing locusts with the power to torment people for five months. These locusts are described as having the appearance of horses prepared for battle, with faces like human faces, hair like women's hair, teeth like lions' teeth, and stingers like scorpions. They are allowed to torment people who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads. This could cause widespread suffering and death.

6. Sixth Trumpet (Revelation 9:13-21): Four angels are released, and a third of humanity is killed by plagues of fire, smoke, and sulfur that come from the mouths of the horses. This could cause massive loss of life and widespread destruction.

Based on these descriptions, you could estimate the time it would take for one-third of the Earth's population to be impacted by these calamities. However, keep in mind that the Book of Revelation is highly symbolic and apocalyptic, so any estimation would be speculative. Additionally, interpretations of the Book of Revelation vary widely among different Christian traditions.

You

yes- just a thought experiment- what would that time span look like?

ChatGPT

Certainly, let's explore this as a thought experiment.

Let's assume that the events described in the trumpet judgments of Revelation occur over a period of time rather than all at once, and that each judgment has a significant impact on the Earth's population.

Given the severity of the judgments, it's reasonable to assume that each judgment could lead to a significant loss of life and societal disruption. However, the exact time span for these events is not specified in the text, so any estimation would be speculative.

So I asked for a final summary paper:

Title: The Symbolic Nature of the Seven Trumpets in the Book of Revelation

The Book of Revelation, the final book of the New Testament, is filled with vivid imagery and symbolic language. Among the most striking visions in Revelation are the seven trumpet judgments described in Revelation 8:6–9:21. These trumpet judgments depict cataclysmic events that are often interpreted as literal, apocalyptic events. However, a closer examination of the text suggests that these judgments may be more symbolic than literal, and that they likely represent figurative events unfolding over a large span of time.

The seven trumpet judgments are as follows:

1. First Trumpet (Revelation 8:7): Hail and fire, mixed with blood, are thrown to the earth, burning up a third of the trees and all the green grass.

2. Second Trumpet (Revelation 8:8-9): Something like a great mountain, burning with fire, is thrown into the sea, causing a third of the sea to become blood, a third of the living creatures in the sea to die, and a third of the ships to be destroyed.

3. Third Trumpet (Revelation 8:10-11): A great star, blazing like a torch, falls from the sky on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. The name of the star is Wormwood, and a third of the waters turn bitter, causing many people to die from drinking the water.

4. Fourth Trumpet (Revelation 8:12): A third of the sun, moon, and stars are struck, causing a third of them to be darkened.

5. Fifth Trumpet (Revelation 9:1-12): A star falls from heaven, and the abyss is opened, releasing locusts with the power to torment people for five months. These locusts are described as having the appearance of horses prepared for battle, with faces like human faces, hair like women's hair, teeth like lions' teeth, and stingers like scorpions. They are allowed to torment people who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads.

6. Sixth Trumpet (Revelation 9:13-21): Four angels are released, and a third of humanity is killed by plagues of fire, smoke, and sulfur that come from the mouths of the horses.

7. Seventh Trumpet (Revelation 11:15-19): The kingdom of the world becomes the kingdom of our Lord and of his Messiah, and he will reign forever and ever. The temple of God in heaven is opened, and within his temple is seen the ark of his covenant. There are flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake, and a severe hailstorm.

While these judgments are often interpreted as literal, end-times events, there are several reasons to believe that they may be more symbolic than literal. First, the Book of Revelation is filled with symbolic language and imagery, and the trumpet judgments are no exception. Second, the events described in the trumpet judgments are highly symbolic and fantastical, suggesting that they may not be meant to be taken literally. Finally, the timeframe over which the trumpet judgments are said to occur is not specified in the text, suggesting that they may represent figurative events unfolding over a large span of time.

To illustrate this point, let us consider the impact of the trumpet judgments on the Earth's population. If we take the example of the sixth trumpet judgment, which states that a third of humanity will be killed by plagues of fire, smoke, and sulfur, and we assume that this judgment unfolds over a period of 40 years, we can estimate the impact on the Earth's population.

Currently, an average of 150,000 people die every day worldwide. If we multiply this by the number of days in 40 years (14,600 days), we get an estimated total of 2.19 billion deaths over 40 years.

This figure is close to the estimated 2.6 billion deaths that would result if one-third of the Earth's population were to be killed, as described in the sixth trumpet judgment.

This suggests that the trumpet judgments may not be meant to be taken literally, but rather symbolically, representing figurative events unfolding over a large span of time. As such, we should approach the trumpet judgments with caution, being mindful of the symbolic nature of the text and the rich tapestry of imagery and language in the Book of Revelation.

Quite interesting....... impressive and disturbing at the same time!

Every response was written in 4 seconds or less!

Signs, Seals, Trumpets, Bowls and The Other Weird Stuff in Revelation

Note: I have re-visited The Book of Revelation during a time where I am leading discussions (not really teaching) this amazing book in Sunday School this quarter. These writings are a product of re-thinking and updating research for the class.

Many prophetic passages use poetic metaphor and apocalyptic imagery. Apocalyptic or poetic imagery must be treated in a different manner than a straight-forward historical account. Once again the key to understanding prophetic imagery (e.g., stars falling from heaven, the sun becoming dark, the sky rolled up like a scroll, etc.) is to see how such imagery is used in the Bible, rather than use current events and modern scientific discoveries to speculate (e.g., nuclear war, bar codes, computer chips in the hand and forehead, attack helicopters, tanks, etc.). Most books written on prophecy today are disconnected exegetically from the biblical text and thus are nothing more than the clever fantasies of the different authors. Brian Schwertley

In our class we are now in some of the most intriguing, disturbing, and confusing parts of Revelation, particularly Chapters 6-20.

This book portrays similar and even parallel sections around central truth. I liken it to Jesus using the analogy to labor pains.

There is a pattern in the seal/trumpet/bowl judgements (Rev. 6-16)…. let’s look at these from a wide view for a moment.

7 SEALS- 6 and then an interlude (pause)- 7th seal is 7 Trumpets

7 TRUMPETS- 6 trumpets and then an interlude- (brief hint of 7 Thunders)

7 THUNDERS Rev 10: 1-7- (Don’t guess with God?- He cuts short?)

7 BOWLS – Rev. 16- Finality



THE IMPORTANCE OF THE INTERLUDES

These “interludes” are important as well. In my view, the flow of God is much like birth pains..there is a growing action toward a climactic end, but before the dam breaks..there is a pause.. even a pull back.

So much of life is like that. Part of God’s rhythm of life is like that. Think about physical pain- it builds, grows, and then subsides. This has always been a sign of God’s grace. My greatest fear of hell has always been the pain that never ebbs…….

For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are but the beginning of the birth pains. (Jesus in the Olivet Discourse- Matthew 24/ Mark 13/ and Luke 21.)

These signs are always in place- they grow in intensity- but then withdraw…but one day the water will break!

But part of God’s plan is silence….solitude… waiting…..

Let's think through the child birth experience:

Signs- We definitely see the expectant mother is pregnant. We know nature, we know what to expect, we just don't quite know the timing.

Contractions- Building pressure

The Pause- 

Let's don't miss the importance of the pause- again...it is a gracious act that the Lord allows intense pain to ebb away.

In my view, I have actually mis-used the idea of recapitulation from the technical sense (I'll elaborate a little more later in this post). It is actually better to call it a 'refluency;.

In the early days of the American revolution, American poet Phyllis Wheatley,  wrote a beautiful line in the poem, "To His Excellency, General Washington":

Enwrapp'd in tempest and a night of storms;
Astonish'd ocean feels the wild uproar,

The refluent surges beat the sounding shore; 

Refluent waves is the "pullback" and building of the next wave.... it is a pause in the energy of motion but no power is lost. Maybe another thought experiment is the 'eye of a hurricane" where in the middle of the storm everything is calm and eerily mundane....

There were 400 silent years between the last Old Testament prophecy and the appearance of Jesus.

Silence sometimes can be deafening.

Have you ever tried to practice solitude?

A lot of noise is happening all around us. But we must NEVER forget the Bible’s command- “Be still and know that I am God”.

In our contemporary world, we need to ‘get away’- ‘turn off technology’. Then God can most clearly communicate to us.

Keep remembering…much of Revelation is figurative and the images are all throughout the Old Testament.

Not a literal half an hour- not literal days- there is a difference in God’s time and Man’s time

Also, I keep seeing the Old Testament and temple references. Do you see the incense of heaven and the smoke of hell in both testaments? Do you see the Egyptian plagues and references to the Exodus?

Did you notice the presence of God on the mountain along with the smoke and thunder?

“In the midst of these sufferings and woe, we are to point men and women to the Gospel of Grace found only in Jesus Christ. We are also to warn them to repent and believe while they have time.” Max A Forsythe

As the book unfolds… we see seven parallel passages and grow in intensity and ebb, like ocean waves, that grow in intensity around the same basic truth.

• Section 1- Chapters 1-3- The Church is active, under assault, under the direction of Jesus
• Section 2- Chapters 4-7- The Throne and the Scroll – The Seals
• Section 3- Chapters 8-11- The Trumpets
• Section 4- Chapters 12-14- The Cosmic battle of forces
• Section 5- Chapters 15-16- The Bowls
• Section 6- Chapters 17-19- Babylon and the Beasts
• Section 7- Chapters 20-22- Final doom and ultimate glory

The difficulty is that though the narrative follows a structure, the events are hard to place in a linear storyline.

I have to agree with George Alan Ladd: “The main purpose of prophecy is not to answer all our questions about the future, but enable believers to live in the present in light of the future.”

As the seals are broken…apocalyptic images are described……

Symbols- The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse

The first of the seals unleash a famous and well known Biblical image: four horses of color who wield judgement on the earth. We also see similar horses in Zechariah:

ZECHARIAH 6:1 Again I lifted my eyes and saw, and behold, four chariots came out from between two mountains. And the mountains were mountains of bronze. 2 The first chariot had red horses, the second black horses, 3 the third white horses, and the fourth chariot dappled horses—all of them strong.4 Then I answered and said to the angel who talked with me, “What are these, my lord?” 5 And the angel answered and said to me, “These are going out to the four winds of heaven, after presenting themselves before the Lord of all the earth.

These symbols can create issues in our interpretation of prophecy:

Can you symbolize parts of Scripture and still keep a high view of Scripture? Should we weigh literal interpretations more accurate than figurative interpretations?

And I never have had an issue with Scripture having symbolism and yet is still accurate, authoritative, inspired, and true! Is this the Real Reality? No, these are visions…but they represent deeper truths!

These seals represent a type of “pre-judgment judgment” and “pre-wrath wrath”….

Man cannot sin without consequences!

In a sense, we have freedom to live within God’s boundaries or to rebel… but make no mistake, choices come with consequences that are contained in the activity itself! Everything suffers because of sin! For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God. 

For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to corruption and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of childbirth until now. (Romans 8:19-22 ESV)

This theory of refluency offers a compelling lens through which to interpret the Book of Revelation, providing insights into its complex narrative structure and theological themes. According to my thought experiment, each vision and event in Revelation can be understood as recapitulating or re-enacting the overarching spiritual struggle between good and evil throughout human history. 

Many have attributed an originator of this thinking to Augustine and the technical application of recapitulation...

A cyclical pattern of sin, repentance, and redemption, central to Augustine's concept of recapitulation, finds resonance in the repeated cycles of judgment, tribulation, and eventual triumph depicted in Revelation. Through this framework, the visions of seals, trumpets, and bowls can be seen not merely as discrete events but as successive stages in the unfolding drama of God's plan for redemption and judgment. Furthermore, the use of symbols and imagery in Revelation, such as the Lamb, the dragon, and the new Jerusalem, can be interpreted as representing archetypal elements of the human spiritual journey, echoing themes of sin, sacrifice, and ultimate victory. Thus, by applying the theory of recapitulation, readers can gain deeper insight into the timeless and universal truths conveyed through the vivid and enigmatic imagery of the Book of Revelation. (An AI answer to my question on this topic- in 15 seconds no less!)

A LINE ? MORE LIKE A CIRCLE

Recently, I have been reading an incredible book by David Bodanis entitled: E=MC2, A Biography of the World's Most Famous Equation.

And in that book we learn that an original thinker in terms of the Law of Conservation of Energy was Michael Faraday.

Bodanis writes:

The word energy is surprisingly new, and can only be traced in its modern sense to the mid 1800s. It wasn't that people before then had not recognized that there were different powers around—the crackling of static electricity, or the billowing gust of a wind that snaps out a sail. It's just that they were thought of as unrelated things. There was no overarching notion of "Energy" within which all these diverse events could fit. One of the men who took a central role in changing this was Michael Faraday,

Sir Humphry Davy was speaking on electricity, and on the hidden powers that must exist behind the surface of our visible universe.

Because Faraday did not have that bias of thinking in straight lines, he could turn to the Bible for inspiration. The Sandemanian religious group he belonged to believed in a different geometric pattern: the circle. Humans are holy, they said, and we all owe an obligation to one another based on our holy nature. I will help you, and you will help the next person, and that person will help another, and so on until the circle is complete. This circle wasn't merely an abstract concept. Faraday had spent much of his free time for years either at the church talking about this circular relation, or engaged in charity and mutual helping to carry it out. He got to work studying the relationship between electricity and magnetism in the late summer of 1821.

This circle wasn't merely an abstract concept. Faraday had spent much of his free time for years either at the church talking about this circular relation, or engaged in charity and mutual helping to carry it out. He got to work studying the relationship between electricity and magnetism in the late summer of 1821. It was twenty years before Alexander Graham Bell, the inventor of the telephone, would be born; more than fifty years before Einstein. Faraday propped up a magnet. From his religious background, he imagined a whirling tornado of invisible circular lines swirling around it. If he were right, then a loosely dangling wire could be tugged along, caught in those mystical circles like a small boat getting caught up in a whirlpool. He connected the battery. And immediately he had the discovery of the century.

This immediately got me into re-thinking these seal/trumpets, and bowls in Revelation!

While Michael Faraday's visualization of magnetic fields using circles may not directly relate to St. Augustine's theory of recapitulation, there could be some metaphorical parallels that could be drawn. In Faraday's case, the use of circles helped him understand the dynamic and interconnected nature of magnetic fields, with lines of force forming closed loops. Similarly, Augustine's concept of recapitulation emphasizes the cyclical nature of human existence and spiritual history, with events repeating and echoing throughout time.

One could draw a metaphorical connection between Faraday's circles representing the interconnectedness and cyclical nature of magnetic fields and Augustine's idea of recapitulation, where the events of human history and individual lives are seen as interconnected and repeating in patterns of sin, repentance, and redemption. Both concepts involve the idea of cycles and interconnectedness, albeit in different contexts—Faraday in the realm of physical phenomena and Augustine in the realm of spiritual and theological understanding.

We shouldn't be surprised by circles- we see it in nature all the time, especially the renewal of seasons. 

Again- much of this is HOTLY debated and many of my readers have already taken me to task on my many errors in interpretation.... I'm not offended at all... this is just fun being immersed in these ideas and it keeps me alert.

The Lord could come back or I could be called to meet Him any time- I want to be ready and I am so thankful for His grace!

How about you?

In Nov. of 2024, I wrote the lyrics and published an album on this book- you can hear all of the songs here:

Album: Book of Revelation